Waiting for recovery.....
- Thread starter austin
- Start date
Philwhiskeydrinker
Well-Known Member
That dodgy starter that you fixed Austin?
As long as theres not a pool of oil or it didn't end with a big bang it should be fixable [emoji2]
As long as theres not a pool of oil or it didn't end with a big bang it should be fixable [emoji2]
austin
Well-Known Member
Starter motor or battery. 
I stopped to put my ear plugs in about 8 miles down the road and it wouldn't restart - very very sluggish on the starter motor which got very hot. It spun (well chugged) a little faster when it cooled down but even with jump leads from a car it didn't want to spin up and wouldn't start.
Recovery took 90minutes to arrive and i have now removed and checked the starter - all looks ok. Tank off and main earth cleaned - was pretty manky under there. All relevant electrical connectors cleaned and polished and looking good, including contact between starter motor and engine. Battery on charge - when the charger was first connected while the battery was on the bike it went into recovery mode but off the bike it is on normal charging. Just waiting for it to come up to recharged and then I can test it all. Fingers crossed.
I stopped to put my ear plugs in about 8 miles down the road and it wouldn't restart - very very sluggish on the starter motor which got very hot. It spun (well chugged) a little faster when it cooled down but even with jump leads from a car it didn't want to spin up and wouldn't start.
Recovery took 90minutes to arrive and i have now removed and checked the starter - all looks ok. Tank off and main earth cleaned - was pretty manky under there. All relevant electrical connectors cleaned and polished and looking good, including contact between starter motor and engine. Battery on charge - when the charger was first connected while the battery was on the bike it went into recovery mode but off the bike it is on normal charging. Just waiting for it to come up to recharged and then I can test it all. Fingers crossed.
Philwhiskeydrinker
Well-Known Member
Bloody nora, theres some complexity going on under the tank Austin
austin
Well-Known Member
You are right Phil, there's a lot going on under there. The ABS stuff and EFi stuff looks horrendously complex and I suspect that is most of it.
This is the first time I have taken the tank off, and TBH I have been a bit intimidated at the thought of taking it off as the Haynes manual goes to something like 18 steps but in the end it was pretty straightforward: remove the various panels and trim around the tank, disconnect fuel pump(s) power and lines, disconnect drain and breather pipes, undo the mounting bolts, remove air box intake, and lift, pull back, and off. It was bloody heavy as it was 2/3rds full but there's plenty of good grab points and its unpainted plastic so slightly less care can be afforded. I spent ages trying to work out how to release the electrical connectors, and then one of the mounting bolts was seized but the impact driver soon got it out (and I even realised t was a 5mm allen rather than the usual torx head). About an hour to get off and 30mins back on. A lot lot quicker next time.
Battery is still charging and I am edging toward it being a battery problem. The starter is just a basic charger and its difficult to f**k them up (and it was brill immediately after I first "fixed" it), the earths and various connections were all reasonably clean and bright. The only thing I can't then explain is why it wouldn't take a jump start - the jump leads were thin, dirty and hadn't been used in years, plus it was difficult to get a good connection on the bike battery due to all the extra cables attached. So it could be I didn't get much help from the donor battery - I hope anyway. I think I will get a Motobatt, UKGSER is full of good reports about especially for curing slow cranking of a hot engine - which where all this started.
Down to my mum's in the car tomorrow now.
This is the first time I have taken the tank off, and TBH I have been a bit intimidated at the thought of taking it off as the Haynes manual goes to something like 18 steps but in the end it was pretty straightforward: remove the various panels and trim around the tank, disconnect fuel pump(s) power and lines, disconnect drain and breather pipes, undo the mounting bolts, remove air box intake, and lift, pull back, and off. It was bloody heavy as it was 2/3rds full but there's plenty of good grab points and its unpainted plastic so slightly less care can be afforded. I spent ages trying to work out how to release the electrical connectors, and then one of the mounting bolts was seized but the impact driver soon got it out (and I even realised t was a 5mm allen rather than the usual torx head). About an hour to get off and 30mins back on. A lot lot quicker next time.
Battery is still charging and I am edging toward it being a battery problem. The starter is just a basic charger and its difficult to f**k them up (and it was brill immediately after I first "fixed" it), the earths and various connections were all reasonably clean and bright. The only thing I can't then explain is why it wouldn't take a jump start - the jump leads were thin, dirty and hadn't been used in years, plus it was difficult to get a good connection on the bike battery due to all the extra cables attached. So it could be I didn't get much help from the donor battery - I hope anyway. I think I will get a Motobatt, UKGSER is full of good reports about especially for curing slow cranking of a hot engine - which where all this started.
Down to my mum's in the car tomorrow now.
outrunner
Well-Known Member
I hope it's a cheap fix Austin, I have 2 bikes fitted with Motobatt batteries and IMO they are great. 90 minutes seems a long time to wait for recovery, I have called the AA out twice, once for the car, and once for a bike and they have attended both within the hour.
Andy.
Andy.
austin
Well-Known Member
Sorry to hear you got stuck Austin, but carbs, points, coil and plugs...........
Yeah yeah, first break down in 55,000 miles though, and if its just the battery....
Britannia Rescue. I had the choice of a mechanic or recovery only. SoS bikes and had to come from Manchester. You are right. A bit crap.
nick949
Well-Known Member
............including however many trouble free miles on this side of the pond
. Can you tell I have time on my hands?Philwhiskeydrinker
Well-Known Member
I don't think I've had recovery come in less than 2 hrs.
I was sat at the top of the M62 for 6 hrs in the snow a couple of years ago, in a works van.
When they did turn up it was a little Transit type flat bed, absolutely no use for a Luton van so they drove off 'no one told us' they said.
When the proper recovery truck turned up, they'd only take me to the nearest services to then swap onto an AA owned truck for the actual recovery - the (un)funny bit, I was only about 10 miles from home!
You couldn't make it up.
But the best bit, every time I called the AA that day, I had to listen the spiel of are you out of the vehicle & in a safe place etc etc
Each time I replied, NO I'm sat in the warm van with the radio & heater on, I would have died waiting outside for you lot (it was near freezing, blowing a gale with sleet & snow)
Broke down 3pm, home for 10pm after the boss picked me up from the services!
I was sat at the top of the M62 for 6 hrs in the snow a couple of years ago, in a works van.
When they did turn up it was a little Transit type flat bed, absolutely no use for a Luton van so they drove off 'no one told us' they said.
When the proper recovery truck turned up, they'd only take me to the nearest services to then swap onto an AA owned truck for the actual recovery - the (un)funny bit, I was only about 10 miles from home!
You couldn't make it up.
But the best bit, every time I called the AA that day, I had to listen the spiel of are you out of the vehicle & in a safe place etc etc
Each time I replied, NO I'm sat in the warm van with the radio & heater on, I would have died waiting outside for you lot (it was near freezing, blowing a gale with sleet & snow)
Broke down 3pm, home for 10pm after the boss picked me up from the services!
MooN
Active Member
A few years ago I discovered a way to become a N01 priority for recovery. ( to be fair it was on the french autoroute network where 30 minutes is considered maxamim acceptable recovery time anyway) Thanks to renault I had to phone for recovery ( don't get me started...) and when they asked me if I was in a safe place I replied that yes "but it's minus 14 degrees outside and I have a 10 year old and 2 five year olds in the car with no heat..." apparently they came to get us first despite others waiting...
Hope it turns out to be just a battery problem Austin. I presume you've tried hitting it with a Hammer?
Hope it turns out to be just a battery problem Austin. I presume you've tried hitting it with a Hammer?
austin
Well-Known Member
I replaced the brushes when I "fixed" it a few weeks ago. The problem is fairly well documented for GS's: the starter is (as you will know) a bit lazy at the best of times but is alarmingly slow when the engine is hot. Mine had got past alarming and into worryingly slow so i stripped the starter motor and replaced the brushes about a month ago. As I said, all good to start with after the fix, but down in Wales the very slow starting on a hot engine returned. although I have to say it was also a bit slow on the cold engine this morning and then the engine would barely turn when I attempted to restart it after stopping for a minute fit earplugs.
The optimate has completed its cycle now and it shows as fully recovered and charged. I am going to hook it up in a minute and give it a go. Wish me luck.
austin
Well-Known Member
Well that was unsuccessful but with a bit of a hint as to where the fault is. Starter barely turned even with a full battery, however it was only showing 12.45 volts where I would have been expecting 12.7 as it had just completed a charge cycle on the optimate. Rather clinchingly though the voltage drop while cranking was down to 7 to 5 volts, so it looks like the battery is well and truly fecked. I am going to hook the bike up to the car battery tomorrow without the bikes battery is to see if that will turn the starter. If it does then its deffo the battery.
I have to get the bike running for Monday as I am needed down at my mum's for a few days.
I have to get the bike running for Monday as I am needed down at my mum's for a few days.
sounds the issue I had with my starter motor on the 1150
they are known for the magnets dislodging and jamming up the starter, starts off just turning slowly then eventually jams up completely and kills the battery
I have a spare starter motor in the garage now for this very reason
they are known for the magnets dislodging and jamming up the starter, starts off just turning slowly then eventually jams up completely and kills the battery
I have a spare starter motor in the garage now for this very reason
austin
Well-Known Member
The latest in this saga.....
1. Bike hooked direct to car battery via bike's battery tenders = no noticeable difference in turning the starter. Conclusion = its the starter.
2. Completely stripped and cleaned the starter (I am getting good at this now about 40 mins from start to finish). Nothing untoward except a bit of grease leaked up from the gear box onto the windings and magnet. Reattached to the bike but still no use. Conclusion its not the starter, unless something sinister is going on inside it.
3. Voltage at battery 13v+ straight off the charger, drops to 12.4 ish on the bike and with the starter chugging its down to 6volts. This would point to the battery but see test 1 above, although I still have my doubts about the jump leads and their connection.
4. Voltage drop across the cables too the starter motor is less than 0.5volts on earth and +ve sides.
I have a ordered a battery anyway and its only £44.99 for a Motobatt from M&P. It should be here Tuesday. If that doesn't sort it it got to be the starter. Secondhand £105, reconditioned £180 exchange; £258 for a new upgraded one.
1. Bike hooked direct to car battery via bike's battery tenders = no noticeable difference in turning the starter. Conclusion = its the starter.
2. Completely stripped and cleaned the starter (I am getting good at this now about 40 mins from start to finish). Nothing untoward except a bit of grease leaked up from the gear box onto the windings and magnet. Reattached to the bike but still no use. Conclusion its not the starter, unless something sinister is going on inside it.
3. Voltage at battery 13v+ straight off the charger, drops to 12.4 ish on the bike and with the starter chugging its down to 6volts. This would point to the battery but see test 1 above, although I still have my doubts about the jump leads and their connection.
4. Voltage drop across the cables too the starter motor is less than 0.5volts on earth and +ve sides.
I have a ordered a battery anyway and its only £44.99 for a Motobatt from M&P. It should be here Tuesday. If that doesn't sort it it got to be the starter. Secondhand £105, reconditioned £180 exchange; £258 for a new upgraded one.